Yellow Jackets

klondike · Post by **klondike** » Sat Jul 26, 2008 7:34 pm

Hello Cubfan, Hello Mr. Paws.

It is a good thing to see folks a bit confused.

Too many folks go into those mountains with set ideas and emerge twenty years later with the same ideas.

Your point about math is well taken. The assumptions one makes will drive the math anywhere you want it. As I like to remind dog, math is just a game that everyone agrees to the ground rules in advance.

Having said that it seems that math does tell us something about the external world except one might argue the quantum world where as Mr. Heisenburg reminds us everything is well uncertain.

So how is it with assumptions about the Superstitions?

Anyway for example when I see Circlestone from above I have always thought it looks like an O. One might think that perhaps someone might have thought since Circlestone is one of the gates to the sacred to refer to the sacred as Oz.

Likewise to the nw of Circlestone one finds Klondike Springs, what an interesting name. To some it is just a spring but just maybe it is a guidepost to the holy. Just look for a trail with starbursts and take it to the Salt River.

And as you know not questioning the obvious is well unfortunate. For example let`s take Jacob.

A well educated man who traveled here from Europe and mined Gold from Georgia to the Sierra Nevada. A sophisticated man who knew the pleasures of the flesh as practiced in Virginia City, Nevada and the pleasures of the soul that can be found in San Francisco.

A man who would carve in square set timbering in LDM 1 the phrase:

Es thut kein Gang so gut
Er hat enen esernen Hut.
Jacob

Why would such a man end up in the Valley of the Sun? Was he there for Julia`s ice cream, the local night life, the intellectual stimulation of the locals, or the thrill of being followed into the Superstitions time and time again and being a moment away from death. Either the bullet coming from a local or a death orchestrated by the Apaches.

Perhaps the answer is right in front of us and always has been.

He simply came home. To care for the one thing that a sophisticated man would understand. Not Gold or money he came home to care for his soul and the souls of his forefathers.

I am reminded of what dad said a long time ago their is a beautiful history in those mountains that does not begin with the selling of tickets to Jacob`s deathbed or stealing the gold from a dying man.

I hope you gentlemen find that history.

Who knows who you may encounter on your trek.

May the thundergods look down on you kindly.

Klondike

pippinwhitepaws · Post by **pippinwhitepaws** » Sat Jul 26, 2008 7:53 pm

thank you...perhaps i will take that walk this winter...

Cubfan64 · Post by **Cubfan64** » Thu Jul 31, 2008 10:00 am

Anyway Dog suggested if you want to have a little fun take the heart insert place it in a layout of circlestone and see what lines up.

Problem is, which way do you allign the heart insert since it's always pointing at something no matter which way it's alligned?

Did you know there is a set of stones similar to Circlestone but larger a few miles NE of the Angel Spring ruins?

zentull · Post by **zentull** » Thu Jul 31, 2008 2:23 pm

Swept the Brewers.....................Yeah

klondike · Post by **klondike** » Thu Jul 31, 2008 2:26 pm

Hello Paul,

Interesting points you make.

While Dog is the expert on the maps, I will do the best I can for now. Dog is involved in other things right now.

Two points to consider.

Which insert are we talking about? The Latin Heart or the Trail Map insert that can take one to little Boulder Canyon.

Let`s assume for the moment we are talking about the Trail Map insert. First one needs to think of the four Trail Maps as a system insead of simply a trail to one particular place in the mountains. Two trail maps are in the public domain, two are not. They do take one to little boulder canyon but they also takes you elsewhere.

Always thought that was a wonderful bit of deception. Although the creators of the Stone Maps did not know they were accomplishing such an importent task. They only knew of one trail and that is the one they recorded.

That is one of the reason the points along the way are importent. They connect the system of 6 trails. That is until the Aliens removed most of them.

Where is the elsewhere. One of them is Circlestone. If one uses the maps that way then both Circlestone and klondike springs are on that map. Orientation then is fairly straightforward.

Also notice the O on the trail map insert. Wonder what that is all about? Particularly if you use the trail maps to get to Circlestone...

Now we get to the point of the last two maps. Those two maps will take you to Oz from any of the six end points. Those two maps are now part of a border to a flower garden.

Knowing this then looking west to little boulder canyon reveals a connection to another trail system, another and another. Or as someone used to point out you can see all the way from Ork Mountain to Oz.

He had a way with words.

I assume you are speaking about the area around Roger`s Canyon. I suspect the locals had a lot to do with that but I could be wrong.

The map room in the other does indicate things in that area, but at the end of the day our interests were elsewhere.

The second point is this. The latin heart is the Rosetta Stone of the whole system. It is the heart of the whole system.

Good luck to you.

Klondike

Cubfan64 · Post by **Cubfan64** » Thu Jul 31, 2008 3:04 pm

zentull wrote:Swept the Brewers.....................Yeah

And except for one game it was a CRUSHING 4 game series defeat!!

I kept telling myself I wasn't going to get too excited until the end of August - dangit, they're sucking me in now though!!!

You still hate Edmunds??

I'm loving the Rich Harden acquisition - even if his arm falls off next year. Wish they could have gotten a little short relief help, but can't be too greedy I guess.

If only they can get hot at the right times, we might get a chance to toast a WS win in person this year

Cubfan64 · Post by **Cubfan64** » Thu Jul 31, 2008 3:06 pm

klondike wrote:Hello Paul,

Interesting points you make.

While Dog is the expert on the maps, I will do the best I can for now. Dog is involved in other things right now.

Two points to consider.

Which insert are we talking about? The Latin Heart or the Trail Map insert that can take one to little Boulder Canyon.

Let`s assume for the moment we are talking about the Trail Map insert. First one needs to think of the four Trail Maps as a system insead of simply a trail to one particular place in the mountains. Two trail maps are in the public domain, two are not. They do take one to little boulder canyon but they also takes you elsewhere.

Always thought that was a wonderful bit of deception. Although the creators of the Stone Maps did not know they were accomplishing such an importent task. They only knew of one trail and that is the one they recorded.

That is one of the reason the points along the way are importent. They connect the system of 6 trails. That is until the Aliens removed most of them.

Where is the elsewhere. One of them is Circlestone. If one uses the maps that way then both Circlestone and klondike springs are on that map. Orientation then is fairly straightforward.

Also notice the O on the trail map insert. Wonder what that is all about? Particularly if you use the trail maps to get to Circlestone...

Now we get to the point of the last two maps. Those two maps will take you to Oz from any of the six end points. Those two maps are now part of a border to a flower garden.

Knowing this then looking west to little boulder canyon reveals a connection to another trail system, another and another. Or as someone used to point out you can see all the way from Ork Mountain to Oz.

He had a way with words.

I assume you are speaking about the area around Roger`s Canyon. I suspect the locals had a lot to do with that but I could be wrong.

The map room in the other does indicate things in that area, but at the end of the day our interests were elsewhere.

The second point is this. The latin heart is the Rosetta Stone of the whole system. It is the heart of the whole system.

Good luck to you.
Klondike

Thank you for the insights Klondike - back to my research

The circle of stones I heard about is about 3 miles NE of the Roger's Canyon cliff dwellings site.

Stay tuned, you know I'll have more questions soon

Cubfan64 · Post by **Cubfan64** » Thu Jul 31, 2008 3:08 pm

Sorry about that guys - I HATE the quote feature here, it never works right if you don't go in and adjust it and I forgot this time.

It also doesn't help that I can't go back in and edit anything, although that's not such a bad option I guess

Joe Ribaudo · Post by **Joe Ribaudo** » Thu Jul 31, 2008 3:52 pm

Paul,

Just for clarification, the Latin Heart is not an insert.........as far as I know.

Joe

djui5 · Post by **djui5** » Thu Jul 31, 2008 5:53 pm

Cubfan64 wrote:Sorry about that guys - I HATE the quote feature here, it never works right if you don't go in and adjust it and I forgot this time.

Up at the top is the "profile" button. Click that and on the list where it says "Always Allow HTML", check no and save the changes

Cubfan64 · Post by **Cubfan64** » Thu Jul 31, 2008 6:13 pm

djui5 wrote:
Cubfan64 wrote:Sorry about that guys - I HATE the quote feature here, it never works right if you don't go in and adjust it and I forgot this time.
Up at the top is the "profile" button. Click that and on the list where it says "Always Allow HTML", check no and save the changes

Thanks djui - I bow at the feet of the computer zen master

djui5 · Post by **djui5** » Fri Aug 01, 2008 6:08 am

Cubfan64 wrote:
djui5 wrote:
Cubfan64 wrote:Sorry about that guys - I HATE the quote feature here, it never works right if you don't go in and adjust it and I forgot this time.
Up at the top is the "profile" button. Click that and on the list where it says "Always Allow HTML", check no and save the changes
Thanks djui - I bow at the feet of the computer zen master

haha! You should be bowing to "count" then as that is who told me about it

pippinwhitepaws · Post by **pippinwhitepaws** » Fri Aug 01, 2008 12:11 pm

"That is one of the reason the points along the way are importent. They connect the system of 6 trails..."

something just made sense. wow...one sees the same information, over and over....then finally the light comes on...

djui5 · Post by **djui5** » Fri Aug 01, 2008 5:32 pm

pippinwhitepaws wrote:
something just made sense. wow...one sees the same information, over and over....then finally the light comes on...

What light came on? share share share!

pippinwhitepaws · Post by **pippinwhitepaws** » Sat Aug 02, 2008 4:49 pm

Klondike's story gave life to a pictograph.

djui5 · Post by **djui5** » Sat Aug 02, 2008 5:49 pm

pippinwhitepaws wrote:Klondike's story gave life to a pictograph.

Oh...I know what your talking about I think

pippinwhitepaws · Post by **pippinwhitepaws** » Sat Aug 02, 2008 6:03 pm

well, you are down there...go see where it leads.
it was 95+ up here today ,storm clouds everywhere...faking it of course...to damn hot for me.

djui5 · Post by **djui5** » Sat Aug 02, 2008 8:50 pm

Too hot for me too

I get really bad headaches even hiking in Sept

pippinwhitepaws · Post by **pippinwhitepaws** » Sat Aug 02, 2008 8:54 pm

this winter then...
it was 95+ up here today...too damn close to the sun...i was whinning about the heat to my sister today..waaaaa...she went off on how mom could never get me to wear shoes down there...things change.

zentull · Post by **zentull** » Mon Aug 04, 2008 12:16 am

I will vouch for the headaches, don't think there is enough aspirin could be carried for a summer hike for poor Randy....

Tell me where boys and I will check it out maybe next week. I am a glutton for punishment and its just a state of mind....right?

klondike · Post by **klondike** » Mon Aug 04, 2008 7:43 am

Mr. Zentull,

Let`s say you follow the trail and you find yourself in the Canyon of the Souls.

You enter into Oz proper, experience the library and the other, its maps and history.

You see the rich gold veins and the clutter of gold and artifacts everywhere.

Would you want to protect this holy place as many others have or would you think say publishing the coordinates and turning this all over to the proper governmental officials make sense?

Maybe you will just have to fall in to answer. The water fall is but a trickle now but the water is a bit warm. Nicely mineralized.

Maybe the trail is only a trail to a truth, not one of the trails to the truth.

Anyway if you do find your way have a beer and grill up a steak before you make a decision.

That is what the one would do. Maybe you are the one to free the souls.

Sorta humerous in a way. It is your second trip there.

Klondike

Cubfan64 · Post by **Cubfan64** » Mon Aug 04, 2008 8:35 am

Let`s say you follow the trail and you find yourself in the Canyon of the Souls.

You enter into Oz proper, experience the library and the other, its maps and history.

You see the rich gold veins and the clutter of gold and artifacts everywhere.

Would you want to protect this holy place as many others have or would you think say publishing the coordinates and turning this all over to the proper governmental officials make sense?

This is exactly what gets everyone thinking isn't it? Until it actually happens, I don't think one truly knows what one would do.

When I find myself in a quiet spot letting my imagination run wild - wondering what it would be like to "stumble" upon some long forgotten or sought after treasures (be they $, historical, etc...) I'm fairly confident I know what I would do.

Personally, thought I wish I did, I don't trust ANY government to do the right thing very often - I'm virtually positive I would not let the government know about it.

Though the desire might be strong to reap whatever financial benefit I could get from selling things, as I've gotten older I realize that $$ are fleeting and dangerous. The more you have, the more you want - there's a reason greed is one of the deadly sins. I might keep an item or two as a reminder of the day I found them, but I believe that's it.

The strongest desire I personally would have is the desire to want to share what I found with likeminded souls - people who want to see something rare and special in their lives. The question is, how do you trust the next person to have the same values you do? It's impossible to truly know what's in another man's heart.

In the end, I believe I would keep a memento or two, take many many photos, spend some time absorbing my finds, make sure I knew how to get back if I ever wanted and then walk away. I may go back now and then to enjoy the moment again, but I certainly wouldn't make the location public.

It's such an interesting question and something each person really has to ponder themselves I guess.

klondike · Post by **klondike** » Mon Aug 04, 2008 8:54 am

Hello Paul,

Congratulations on your find with Novice and Joe. Ms. Clark`s library will be quite the addition to the LDM legend.

Wonder what happened to Stella`s library?

Have to say I agree with you about dealing with the sacred. All I can say is we did what was right for us.

What is left is a different matter.

Maybe the right thing is just to turn it all over to a major museum and let them sort it out.

Having said that everyone who has been to Oz has become a Gatekeeper or married one. That is but one individual but he could never find his way back in. He has a beautiful daughter.

Have a good day.

Our friend is just about settled. He really ought to have a party don`t you think? Have to keep folks from digging up his garden though.

Klondike

Cubfan64 · Post by **Cubfan64** » Mon Aug 04, 2008 9:14 am

Our friend is just about settled. He really ought to have a party don`t you think? Have to keep folks from digging up his garden though

A party is always fun, but I'm afraid even a hint that there may be something of interest in the garden would result in some unscrupulous folks doing what they could do find it.

Thanks for the congratulations on finding Eleanor. It was really enjoyable working with Garry and Joe on this. Garry is an excellent researcher - very organized and meticulously detailed. It was fun following one lead to another and resulted in both of us zeroing in on her from different directions at literally almost the same time

I learned a great deal about how to research and am starting to do some geneology things on my own family with my dad's help now.

As for Stella's library - at this point who knows. There's just as much it all ended up in the garbage after her death as there is that the "holy grail" is on someone's bookshelf who has no idea the importance. The odds of actually locating any of Adolph's things have dropped significantly in my opinion, but anything can happen

I imagine Wayne is wracking his brain trying to remember at what point he may have been close to "Oz." If you do find it Wayne, I'll be satisfied with some photos

pippinwhitepaws · Post by **pippinwhitepaws** » Mon Aug 04, 2008 9:30 am

my unwelcome reply:
i have walked away from gold. one look on someone's face that you cared for all those years..an ya stand there watching the greed wash their face....walk away.

i like to read...tosies in the warm water...leaning back on a rock.
somethings are none of my business.

someone asked me about you the other day...i do hope i gave a positive review.

Lost Dutchman Goldmine

Yellow Jackets

The Way

Oz

Re: Oz

Heart Of The Subject.....

Oz

The Way